New The Underside Video
Posted by BMcC Fri, 05 Oct 2007 10:29:00 GMT
If you’ve been following the news (like I have), you’ll know that development progress stalled for a bit, then picked back up, and now Mr. Lee has even integrated LUA into the game. In MMF. It’s crazy to me that that’s even possible now.
It makes me wonder, at what point should a Click developer just bite the bullet and move on to C/C++? I have a feeling it’d be a lot easier than most think…
Lookin’ sweet.
very nice - fun characters and damn, that guy can move FAST
It still bugs me slightly how the graphics make it seem like “Cave Story: The Fangame”, but even so I think it looks to be a pretty fun game.
“In the vein of Cave Story”? This looks so much like cave story that I think if Pixel made a sequel (not that it’d make sense) it wouldn’t look more like it. I can’t make up my mind about whether that’s good or bad.
Hahaha, I’m sure Arthur’s thrilled that people are still talking about this. ;)
Well, I’ve long since stopped caring about the style and started digging this game for what it is. A well-made, fun game.
The thing is, the game seems pretty heavy on style, and having things like the damage numbers looking like they were ripped wholesale from Cave Story only hurts it. If he were to put in more of his own sense of style, as seen in the title screen, it could maybe get people making positive comparisons to Cave Story instead of accusing it of being a ripoff.
yeah - i think it’s been discussed and established that this game owes it’s existence to a certain story that takes place in caves.
mooooving right along then…
Regardless of where the style came from, it looks damn fun.
bordering on plagiarism.
Looks great, and I don’t think it’s resemblence to Cave Story should be a problem.
glad to hear this project is still alive, I loved the playable demo. and who cares if it looks like Cave Story? everybody loved Cave Story, and everybody wanted more.
It plays a whole lot better than Cave Story so far for what it’s worth. It’s also pretty different in terms of gameplay, having tighter movement and more interesting, linear level design.
Well, he did say the video is misleading as he hasn’t worked much on content yet. I hope that means he’s planning to make it less of a clone visually.
With how programs like MMF and Game Maker are becoming better developed, I don’t think it’s mandatory for someone to do in C/C++ what he could do perfectly in either of those programs. And I don’t think that you have to “byte the bullet”, if those canned program do everything you need for your game without restricting you. Just because you can code from scratch doesn’t mean you’re a better game designer. Those who undermine a game simply because it was made with GM/MMF and not C++ can just screw themselves with a pineapple.
I use GM, so I can say that, while it does make getting the game to work an incredibly easy process, it does NOT make it easy to design a good, solid game. There is a difference between the hordes of GM newbs making their own Click the Clown clones, and people like Paul Eres (Immortal Defence) and Cactus (Clean Asia), not to mention other awesome names.
Gokai: Clearly it’s already a problem. :X
Dustin: I disagree with you up ‘til the word “linear.” ;)
It plays pretty well, but not “a whole lot better.”
By the way, I’m personally one of those eagerly awaiting The Underside. The graphical style is taken from Cave Story, yes, but it has a whole different feel to itself. The experience I had playing the demo was different than playing Cave Story. It was a different type of awesome.
Melly, one problem with a game made in MMF/GM/etc is that the game is automatically Windows-only. An engine written in C/C++ could be ported to other platforms. LUA is very easy to use with C, too.
Melly: Hm. Yeah, I was definitely just talking about programming.
I agree on the point that it’s the artist and not the tools. That’s true (and obvious). But you’re completely wrong apart from that.
No matter how developed MMF or GM may be nowadays, it’s insane to think they’re as powerful or flexible as coding. Nuts.
And what I do with pineapples is my own business. ;)
YoYo is porting GM to the Mac, and Clickteam is making a Java port (for multiplatform we’re assuming).
Reread my post. I never actually said they are as flexible as coding from scratch. I know they aren’t. I said that you shouldn’t HAVE to get from a canned program to coding as a rule, like some people seem to think (not saying you specifically are one of them). You should do so if what you want to make can’t be made in those programs. Like games that can be played in many systems. If you want that, go ahead and learn C. Or Python. Or anything else you want.
Ah, I thought you were ranting me for my comment about switching to code. (The point of which being that some MMF games are that complex now.)
But yeah, I don’t think there’s anyone around these parts who has a problem with MMF/GM games/developers. They’re some of my favourites!
“It makes me wonder, at what point should a Click developer just bite the bullet and move on to C/C++? I have a feeling it’d be a lot easier than most think…”
He does know C++. He’s done work on Garry’s mod, amongst other things. I guess MMF is just his weapon of choice for smaller games.
Glad to see the trouble sorted out.
Now, I do believe this game requires more chainsaws.
And hats.
And horse.
What is wrong with it being like Cave Story? I loved that game, so much so that I am craving another similar experience. Kinda like playing all those Doom clones back in the day because I finished it front to back and still craved a similar experience. Furthermore, I think this really relates to what Jon Mak was talking about at TGS 07.
So you want game makers to make games like the ones before them. Aren’t you the same people who hate on on the big gaming companies because they all copy the popular games before them?
I think its ok if you like similar games, but i have heard a lot of the indie community trashing mainstream games for doing this exact same thing.
Just an observation I had after reading these comments.
Cave Story? sniff
This game reeks of Cave Story to the point where it shouldn’t be considered an original game but as a Cave Story fangame.
It was fun to play, though! I can vouch for that.
Melly: Chainsamurai. And doomerangs.
Hopefully there is some kinda twist to make this game at least a little bit unique. Otherwise I might as well play Cave Story again.
Wait, wait…
What’s a Cave Story? :|
That video had some positively evil situations >:D It looks very tough.
Yeah, from the earlier demo released, I can pretty safely say that while it borrows (ha) most of its audiovisual style from Cave Story, the gameplay is VERY different. It’s like Megaman in fast-forward. Brutal difficulty to be expected.
It’s Cave Story in the same way that Space Giraffe is Tempest. Essentially similar foundations, but once you actually play for more than a couple of minutes, they flow compeltely differently.
@Not Sure
the problem’s not entirely about it being so much like cave story, but why? why choose to take one’s own game in this direction. it’s as if the game’s feeding off from all the cave story fandom.
still looks like a fun game, but the graphical style and gameplay quirks look far too similar. prolly the only reason fans of cave story aren’t bashing this game heavily is:
but yeh, i’m with Pizza on this one. this has to be a fangame. saying otherwise would be an insult to Pixel.
It’s more like metroid and earthbound than cave story when you put aside graphics (And Podunkian’s art style before this was not even that different so to claim it’s all from cave story is ridiculous)
Cave Story wasn’t really very original. It was awesome though. Anyway, I’m delighted to see something similar on the horizon. The Underside seems a bit more fantastical, random (invincible cheeseburger) and videogamey. I am convinced that Metroidvania is the greatest of all game genres and has a future full of unlocked potential. I need to make one or ten.
Dustin: Yeah, you can definitely taste the Metroid, Earthbound, and Mega Man influences…
The Cave Story graphical aping still grates, but man, that is looking like a super-sweet action platformer right there.
From what I’ve experienced, It’s sorta like a cross between Earthbound oddness and Cave story Gameplay. In other words = insanely entertaining.
All I know is that I loved the demo and I can’t wait for the full game. I mean it’s a FREE game which apes certain elements of another FREE game and is completely open about doing so. Where is the problem?
The problem? People like to bitch, thats all. They’re not happy unless they’re bitchin’! Damn bitches.
The only problem is that there was no need for it to ape Cave Story and it would be that much cooler if it had its own style. It still looks like it’s going to be a super-sweet platformer though, which is why people care about whether it’s a bit cooler or not.
I mean, if it looked like it was going to be shit, then it wouldn’t matter at all. But I feel like saying to it “hey man. You don’t need to try to be like that Cave Story. You’re better than that. You’re The Underside, man. Just be yourself.”
The thing that interests me the most about this wonderful little game is that due to it being MMF-based, the final product might end up getting packaged with a level/scenario editor.
That would be a truly wonderful thing.
The reason I still have Knytt Stories installed on my computer is thanks to the boundless amounts of wonderful user-content that’s been created for it by the fan community.
The Underside could just as easily become the Knytt Stories of the platform-shooty genré if it is coupled with such an editor.
And considering that the game’s own scripting engine is LUA-based, the possibilities for creations made by such an editor are nigh-on endless.
I suppose as it’s shaping up to be great it is a bit of a pity that it’ll be forever tied to Cave Story, but I can see the attractiveness of going lo-fi with the graphics if he’s doing everything himself (I shall prolly go the same route on any projects I do wholly myself). The other nods are perhaps a little odd, but you can’t deny they worked well on Cave Story. Besides, who wouldn’t want to be associated with Cave Story in some way? :)
Heh, that’s a good explanation, Anthony. I like that. :)
P.S. – “Cave Story” has been mentioned 34 times (including now) in these comments.
We’re under par!
I still haven’t played Cave Story. It reboots my PC, which is awesome.
Have you guys ever heard of cave story? Its a little bit like this game, so if you think this game looks cool, you should try cave story.
cave story
Cave Story like totally ripped off Doukutsu Monogatari!
is cave story now a meme?
“CAVE STORY RIP-OFF” is kind of a running gag around here, yeah.
I dunno if Cave Story is a meme… but I think “Cave Story is not a meme” might be a meme.
Yeah, I have to second Anthony. The game just seems to have so much potential on it’s own, that the Cave Stoyesque look will always have a little sour aftertaste of “just playing a fangame”.
Man, did noone notice that this game looks a bit like Cave Story?
Anyway, all platformers are Super Mario Bros. fangames.
Bull! They’re all Manic Miner fangames! ;)
Haha, Manic Miner… the game that started it all.
Weeeeell, it’s well established that Matthew Smith actually ripped-off Miner 2049er. The scamp. :P
Hey, did any of you guys notice this kind of looks like Cave Story?
Nevertheless, I tried the demo and despite all probable visual likeness, it plays a lot different from what’s-it’s-name (I recall somebody metion that game over the comments, but I totally forgot what was it). And it is difficult. I still can’t beat the boss. I’m loosing touch, I’d better go play Manic Miner.
Saying this game is like Cave Story is as informing as saying any of the Mother (Earthbound) games are like Dragon Quest.
People will bitch and moan about this being a bit like Cave Story until the day it is released. Once that happens, they will stop complaining and talk about how much fun it is instead.
Why are people so upset when other people say that this game looks alot like Cave Story? I think this is an important thing to discuss.
In my book the author has not only been inspired by Cave Story, but he has basicly stolen the entire graphical style and concept. Even when the enemies the damaged you see the exact same “-x” in a red font.
Should we allow this in the independant gaming scene? This is exactly the thing alot of indy gamers hate when it comes to commercial games.
There is nothing wrong with being inspired by other games, but i think the author has crossed a certain line. If someone would get this “inspired” when it comes to other arts people would call it a copy.
Im not saying the game will suck because of this. In fact, it will probably be great and i’m looking forward to playing it. But instead of saying “stop bitching about this being like Cave Story” we need to discuss this in-depth.
Well, I guess why everyone acts so funny about it, is because this has been discussed into oblivion already. Basically I agree with you, except that we are in no position to tell others what their game should look like and whatnot. In the end, everyone has to decide for himself if he/she can accept it or not, because I don’t think that there will be big changes in the graphics. But yeah, for me it will be hard to fully appreciate it for what it is.
You are all wrong, The Underside is ripping off the Castlevania games with it’s -numbers on hits.
‘There is nothing wrong with being inspired by other games, but i think the author has crossed a certain line. If someone would get this “inspired” when it comes to other arts people would call it a copy.’
This statement is almost scary.
I feel like The Underside -> Cave Story as Kill Bill -> A highly acclaimed kung fu movie (haven’t seen any). If you play the demo I think you’ll see where I’m coming from. If you haven’t changed your mind by the time you’ve met Agent Buddy, then I don’t think there’s any changing your mind.
Eh, that analogy is kind of bogus, Butzo.
Ok this has clearly been discussed to death but here’s my take on this whole thing anyways.
The problem with mainstream games is that they don’t take any risks when making a game. They don’t try anything that they aren’t sure millions of people will play. This usually involves sequel after sequel and copy after copy. In these copies, everything is pretty much the same except for superficial changes, plus a couple new gimmicks. Oh and upgraded technology (graphics).
I mean, he is clearly giving Pixel credit. The things that are copyish are playing with the idea of being a CS copy. I don’t see any creative stagnation, laziness, or unwillingness to take a risk as far as people playing it goes, thus it’s all good in my books.
Oh and CS copy debate aside. This game looks awesome ^_^.
1) He’s within his right to make this game. 2) The game’s visual style is unnecessarily close to Cave Story’s. 3) The game looks really fun.
I don’t think any of those things are mutually exclusive.
I’m very much looking forward to the game and I also don’t understand why he chose to make the graphics so similar… unless there’s a twist ending where The Underside is actually just Pixel’s brain? Dun dun DUN! ^_^
Way to kill the thread Derek. ;D